Avodah Zarah – “Foreign Worship” – The Mind of Dan Perlman

Avodah Zarah – “Foreign Worship” – Playing Well with Others

This tractate is, on its face, a look at the rules surrounding idolatry, which, of course, could be summed up as “don’t”. But its approach is one of practical, day to day living, of how the Jewish community should interact with the “avodei ha kochavim”, literally “worshippers of the stars”, though more colloquially translated as “pagans” or “heathens”. You know, all the non-Jews.

6/20/25, Chapter 1, Page 2 – In short, this introductory page reminds us that idolatry is not just forbidden for Jews, but for all people. Now, it’s left to God to enforce that, and his approach is to let other cultures do their own spiritual exploration, and in time, perhaps millennia, they will come (back) to the Torah. Those that don’t will disappear – the Roman Empire, the Persian Empire, and more, on into the future. It is left as incumbent for the Jewish people to remain steadfast, and while not to proselytize, also not to make things easy on their neighbors when it comes to spiritual matters.
6/21/25, Page 3 – The premise starts with “The Flood”, and that all humans after it are descendants of Noah and were all given the seven Noahide precepts by which to live. Those who did, the Jews, were later given the Torah, during the time of Moses, and the Noahide precepts were expanded to be the Ten Commandments. Those who didn’t live the precepts were Gentiles who are considered, basically, lost souls. There is a path back to the Torah, but it requires commitment and work, it’s not just some parroted words, as some religions accept.
6/22/25, Page 4 – Today’s page feels, to me, at odds with the traditional Jewish view of the inherent good in people. While we acknowledge that there is evil in the world, and that people may be tempted to stray from the path of good, I’ve always learned that overall we consider that most people will opt for the “light side” rather than the dark. Here, the Gemara opines that if it were not for the power of civil government (strangely, not religious authority), people would, in general, head towards the dark side, and not treat each other well. It’s also odd how sparse is the argument against this view.
6/23/25, Page 5 – A topic which I’ve returned to several times over the course of these readings is the revisionist, apologetic approach to numerous historical figures, and in particular, to David. Transgressions, often of extreme nature, are excused as momentary lapses in judgment, or caused by external forces that the person had no control over, or, simply, of no consequence because of the good that the person or community did overall. It’s something we all grapple with in our lives, and often in regard to a political or spiritual leader who, overall we agree with, but choose to overlook certain behaviors; or vice versa, whom we don’t agree with generally, but sometimes does something that we support.
6/24/25, Page 6 – It’s amusing to read of the sages arguing over how we ended up with animals and people who are flawed. After all, one side asserts, Noah, by virtue of having been selected by God, and his entire family who accompanied him, was perfect in mind, body, and spirit, and would only have brought in animals who were perfect as well, and somehow flawed ones must have gotten aboard. The other side points out that there’s no such instruction in the selection of animals, no evidence that Noah or family were perfect, and even creepy crawly animals were brought on board. Genetics folks, genetics. Yeah, I know, they didn’t know about genetics.
6/25/25, Page 7 – As part of a commitment to no idolatrous worship, there’s a rabbinical prohibition from performing an action with members of other religions that will further their idolatrous practices. A large percentage of the Talmudic rabbis hold that you shouldn’t do any business with them on the day of and before one of their religious festivals because it will put them in a good mood for the festival. Some go further and expand that to the three days before. The semi-extremists also opine that it covers three days after, effectively blocking out a week. The real extremists, isolationists, opine that even weekly celebrations, for example the Christian sabbath, Sunday, is an idolatrous festival, and therefore they block off the whole week, every week, and decline to do business with non-Jews.
6/26/25, Page 8 – In case you were concerned that all this non-interaction with idolatrous gentiles was an anti-Christian screed, these are the festivals specifically called out for not helping gentiles during or before: Kalenda, Saturnalia, and Kratesis, the king’s birthday, the anniversary of previous kings’ deaths, funerals, and the wedding days of one’s sons. There’s also a long passage about the equinoxes – Adam, who didn’t grow up, but was created as an adult, panicked upon his first experience of day’s getting shorter, and created festivals for the summer and winter equinoxes, which, the sages opine, gentiles later usurped for idolatrous worship.
6/27/25, Page 9 – Today’s page starts out with a discussion of the dating of documents, and what standard should be used – most of the argument centers on whether we should date things from the end of the Persian Empire or the Roman Empire occupations of Israel. But then we digress – after all, the more religious folk note, the world of man is only to exist for 6000 years. The 2000 pre-Torah years passed, and the the 2000 years of righteous living under the Torah have passed, which was to lead to 2000 years in the glow of the Messiah (not Jesus, whose timing was about right). Unfortunately, it’s noted, that most of humanity hasn’t lived up to the Torah ideals, so we’re already 448 years (back in Talmudic times) into the Messiah’s era. Presumably we still are, and he still hasn’t shown up to start his era.
6/28/25, Page 10 – Who knew that salad vegetables had such import in relations between the people of Israel and the Roman Empire? Harvesting one radish at a time, day by day, is an indication that you plan to kill off your noble enemies one by one. Sending someone arugula is a message accusing them of sexual misconduct. Cilantro is used to seal the deal on a kill contract. Leeks are sign of fear, that you think you might be discovered and eliminated. And lettuce, oh, lettuce, a request for mercy.
6/29/25, Page 11 – Rabbi Yishmael makes an offhand comment about the Hebrew word for cucumbers, kishuin, being an awful lot like the word for harm, kashim, and posits that maybe cucumbers are harmful to the body, like being run through with a sword. The sages of the Gemara respond with… “only if it’s a big cucumber”. If that’s not sexual innuendo wordplay, nothing is.
6/30/25, Page 12 – If you accidentally ingest a leech or a hornet, drink vinegar and hot water together. This will not, apparently, save your life, which for some reason is now doomed, but will extend it sufficiently to put your affairs in order. At night, you cannot drink water, as a demon might be lurking in it. But what if you’re thirsty? Aha, say the sages. You have two options. Take someone with you while you get the water, as the demon will not confront you if you’re not alone, or, if you are, there’s an incantation to recite over the water barrel before removing the top that will drive the demon away.
7/1/25, Page 13 – If you are in a city where there are many gentiles, and therefore idolatrous worship is common, you have to be careful where you shop. If, for example, a produce store presents its products, even with a beautiful display, or a family run restaurant, it is fine to shop at. However, if they decorate it with flowers and symbols that are meant to entice one to enter, it is likely that they are idolaters and that any money spent with them may end up being used for idol worship in some fashion – do not shop there.
7/2/25, Page 14 – Certain items are not permitted to be sold to gentiles, except in circumstances where it is absolutely assured that they will not be used for idolatrous practices. Frankincense, for example, because it was often used as incense in churches. White roosters, because they were used as sacrificial animals (Santeria?) Why the prohibitions? Shared by both Judaism and Christianity, the admonition “do not place stumbling block in front of a blind person” or “do not lead a person into temptation”. Therefore, aver the sages, giving or selling something to someone that will encourage them towards the dark side is prohibited.
7/3/25, Page 15 – Oh you gentiles. We can’t leave you alone with one of our livestock animals. Because we know there’s far too great of a chance that you’ll engage in bestiality. We can, however, sell you an animal, because we’re sure you won’t do that with your own animals as it would lower their value and might even lead to their sterility.
7/4/25, Page 16 – It is prohibited to sell things to gentiles that are likely to cause public harm – weapons, wild animals like bears and lions, and a few other things. Around the arena of produce, food, it’s deemed acceptable to sell to them because not doing so is more likely to piss them off and bring harm rather than harmony. A debate is opened around shields. After all, like a weapon, they can be used to bash. But, the rabbis conclude, the average soldier, if he loses his weapon and only has a shield is more likely to hide behind it or run away like a coward – so selling them shields is ok-ed.
7/5/25, Page 17 – I was going to go into a whole thing on one of the few places that Jesus is mentioned in the Talmud (in a conversation between one of Jesus’ followers and a prominent rabbi), but then… the story of Rabbi Elazar ben Durdayya is too hard to resist. This learned man made it a lifetime goal to sleep with every prostitute in existence. Worldwide. And the claim is, that he did so, and on sleeping with the very last one, she let loose a huge fart, and told him that no matter what he did in the future, he could never repent for his actions. He goes and sits on a mountaintop and cries until he dies, as he realizes that his actions of passion were akin to idol worship.
7/6/25, Page 18 – A series of stories of various sages and non-sages getting involved, or not getting involved, in situations where someone is committing a sin. All meant to illustrate that if you witness a sin and are able to intervene or protest and don’t do so, you are considered guilty of the same sin, and should suffer the same punishment. If you see something, say something, as the modern lingo goes.
7/7/25, Page 19 – The sages opine that while it may be acceptable to receive the basics, the facts, of knowledge, or, in this case, the simple reading of the Torah, from a single teacher, one shouldn’t put all their eggs in one basket, so to speak, when it comes to learning how to interpret and reason that knowledge. In any endeavor, learning from multiple teachers will improve your understanding and your ability to reason and create on your own.
7/8/25, Page 20 – I’m going to just include a passage from today’s page because it’s such an evocative image: They said about the Angel of Death that he is entirely full of eyes. When a sick person is about to die, the Angel of Death stands above his head, with his sword drawn in his hand, and a drop of poison hanging on the edge of the sword. Once the sick person sees him, he trembles and thereby opens his mouth; and the Angel of Death throws the drop of poison into his mouth. From this drop of poison the sick person dies, from it he putrefies, from it his face becomes green.”
7/9/25, Page 21 – A trope that raises its head now and again is that Jews won’t rent or sell homes or fields to gentiles. There are, indeed, some prohibitions in place, historically, particularly, within Israel. But is it discrimination? This question arose as far back as the Talmudic rabbis, nearly two millennia ago. Their reasoning, however, points a different direction, albeit related. Renting a home to gentile risks them bringing items of idol worship into a home owned by a Jew. And renting or selling fields to them means they’re unlikely to tithe produce to the Temple. If, they opine, Israel is to remain a holy land, its physical properties must remain dedicated to the one true God. This is an argument still used by some of the more extreme religious right in Israel.
7/10/25, Chapter 2, Page 22 – We’re back to page 15 and an exploration of the concerns of bestiality. Lending or stabling a domestic animal with a gentile is prohibited because they might get jiggy with it, you know? No worries about buying an animal from them, because they’d never violate their own livestock, nor that of another gentile, who would just kind of know what they’re doing with it. Women should not have female pets because if a gentile has sex with her, he’s just as likely to roll over and continue with the pet. Widows living alone should not have a pet dog because, well, they’d be too tempted, and everyone would know, because the dog would follow her around eagerly. Do I even need to comment?
7/11/25, Page 23 – If yesterday’s page wasn’t enough to convince you that a patriarchal society like the one at the time of the writing of the Talmud was misogynistic, perhaps today’s can pile on. There’s a prohibition reiterated of a woman secluding herself with gentiles, because, obviously, they’d rape her. But what about when she has no choice – she’s been abducted. Not to worry, opine the sages, captors won’t rape her because that would lower her value to her family, and thus reduce the ransom they’re willing to pay.
7/12/25, Page 24 – I know you think I’ve got a bee in my bonnet about King David, and perhaps I do. As this project, and the 929 project have gone on, and I’ve read the non-sanitized versions of the Tanakh and Talmud, the of the rails stuff he did keeps popping up. Today in the midst of a discussion about the provenance of oxen for sacrifice, and having to make sure they were birthed and raised by Torah-keeping Jews, it’s offhand noted that Daivd used to accept oxen from gentiles for sacrifices, and that was all good, so why can’t the rest of us? Only excuses are offered in response.
7/13/25, Page 25 – It is, apparently, okay for a Jewish woman to be secluded with a gentile man if his wife is present. Because while, obviously, a gentile woman would have no qualms about her husband screwing another gentile woman in her presence, being the natural state of the way gentiles act, she would balk at him doing the same with a Jewish woman. No reason is given, but one might make some inferences. The question is if this is actually the case, or just the imaginings of the Talmudic sages?
7/14/25, Page 26 – These sages were real isolationists. According to their rulings, which far depart from Torah teachings in my view (and others’), a Jewish woman cannot help deliver, nurse, or raise a gentile child because he’ll be an idol worshipper, and in turn, a gentile woman is not allowed to help deliver, nurse, or raise a Jewish child because she’ll find an opportunity to kill the child. One has to wonder how much of the whole us versus them in this tractate is based on past experience and how much is pure conjecture.
7/15/25, Page 27 – In an interesting twist from the usual stereotypes, there’s a long discussion about who can perform medical procedures – particularly circumcision – and… haircuts. Because, you know, if a gentile provides such services for free, it’s likely that his plan is to cause a Jew harm through his actions. But… make it a monetary transaction, and the gentile will provide great service, because you know how much those greedy gentiles love and hoard money and will do anything to get more of it.
7/16/25, Page 28 – You know all those fun memes where they talk about how commas or other punctuation matter? So, on today’s page, one of the famed rabbis of history, is being treated by a gentile healer for a malady. She offers to tell him the herbal recipe if he swears never to reveal it to anyone. He responds with “I swear to God I will never reveal this secret”. She gives him the recipe, he tells everyone what it was. When she challenges him, he responds, with the equivalent of, oh, there was a comma in there in my mind, I was saying “I swear, to God I will never reveal this secret”, and I didn’t tell God. And the Talmud accepts this as valid.
7/17/25, Page 29 – Today’s page starts with a bunch of home remedies for various illnesses. Then it segues into a discussion of haircuts, wine, and meat. The upshot of that chat, with some carefully spelled out exceptions, is that we Jews shouldn’t have our hair cut by a gentile, and shouldn’t eat food nor drink wine prepared by one. And, in turn, we really shouldn’t cut their hair or prepare food or wine for them. This whole tractate is basically “we may have to live with heathens, but we don’t have to interact with them”.
7/18/25, Page 30 – Initially, today’s page seems to be about the rules regarding the making and drinking of kosher versus non-kosher wine, and whether the fermentation process is handled by a Jew or a gentile. But it segues rapidly into a long discussion about wine, and some foods, being “exposed”, which apparently may, or may not, attract snakes, who may, or may not, leave traces of venom in the wine or food and thus put us all at risk. I would have to take the time to research it, but I don’t think venomous snakes tend to just go around depositing venom in foodstuffs or wine. I could be wrong.
7/19/25, Page 31 – Why, one might ask, all the concern about wine, and adding in today, beer, that has been produced by gentiles? Why the kosher process for producing either of them in the first place? There is no such process or even suggestion of a process in regard to the production of wine in the Tanakh. Instead, it was added later by the rabbinic councils because, they decided, if we all got chummy with gentiles over a glass of wine or pint of beer, it might lead to “relations”, which might in turn lead to intermarriage. Just looking ahead, down the road for us, those sages,.
7/20/25, Page 32 – You all remember Emperor Hadrian, the Roman leader in the early 2nd century. But, how much do you know about Hadrianic Earthenware? For the low, low price of…. oh wait, no. This amazing earthenware, a white clay of some sort, was used to make jugs to hold the finest of wines made, we’re talking the Grand Crus of the Roman Empire. But what was miraculous about these amphorae is that they completely absorbed the wine, like a sponge, could then be broken into shards and carried anywhere, and then soaked in water and reconstituted at the same quality level as when it was jarred! Winemakers of the world, take note!
7/21/25, Page 33 – At the opposite end of the pottery spectrum from yesterday, apparently Aramean earthenware, from the Pumbadita area, is so non-absorbent that even if the vessel has been used for non-kosher purposes, all it takes is a good scrub and rinse to be considered kosher. Black and white painted earthenware is non-absorbent, but green is absorbent because of the alum in the paint. Unless it’s a fired glaze, in which case all three colors are fine. Unless the glaze is cracked, in which case, it’s no longer fine. Who knew there were so many religious details to absorbency?
7/22/25, Page 34 – Fish stew is prohibited. Unless it’s prepared by a professional. Why is that? Because amateurs always add wine to the pot when making fish stew and pros don’t. Hmm… that sounds kind of backwards to me. And what if it’s kosher wine? Is it okay then to add wine to fish stew? Oh, and thank goodness gentiles no longer sacrifice cows in idol worship, because cheese made from a cow that is to be sacrificed to an idol is prohibited.
- A little further reading on this, just because, indicates that what the sages were talking about was not fish stew in the sense of something like bouillabaise, but rather the making of “muryas”, the regional version of garum, or fish sauce, and adding wine was a way of covering up poor fermentation practices.
7/23/25, Page 35 – We have discovered… lactic precognition! Yes indeed, milk itself knows the fate of the cow from which it comes. The rabbis are quite clear on this – milk from a cow which will one day be slaughtered in a kosher manner is pure white and can be curdled to make cheese. On the other hand, milk from a cow which will one day be slaughtered in a non-kosher manner, and/or used for idol worship purposes, is greenish and won’t curdle to make cheese, it will just spoil instead. Screw your Smartwater™, we have Smartmilk!
7/24/25, Page 36 – Oil. A prohibition on gentile-produced oil (cooking oil). Which, given that there’s no such Torah prohibition leads to a discussion of where all these gentile-centric prohibitions come from. They come from the “18 Decrees of Beit Shammai”, a dubious political maneuver against Beit Hillel, many years before that amounted to a purity test for followers of Shammai to not accept non-Jewish bread, cheese, wine, condiments, various grains, prepared foods, sons, daughters, oaths, testimony, or gifts. Oil is never mentioned. Also, Shammai’s decrees were never codified into rabbinic law.
7/25/25, Page 37 – Rabbi Yehuda Nesla, when he presided over the rabbinic court, often overturned rabbinic prohibitions on items and actions because “people are doing it anyway”. This earned him the nickname “Yehuda the Permissive”. And, in fact, when challenged by Rabbi Simlai about how many things he was telling his followers were actually okay and not really prohibited by the Torah, his response was basically, “you don’t know the half of it”.
7/26/25, Page 38 – Although eating food cooked by gentiles is generally prohibited under kosher law, there are exceptions. Small fish, mushrooms, and porridge are permitted – the explanation is they are items that are not eaten by kings and can be eaten raw. Porridge, raw? Other food items are fine if a Jew participated in the cooking for at least a part of the process, they’re only prohibited if they were solely cooked by a gentile. And, for unexplained reasons, capers, leeks, black-eyed peas, and roasted grains are permitted even if cooked solely by a gentile.
7/27/25, Page 39 – We have quite the discussion today on what sorts of fish are kosher and not. There’s the baseline – a fish is considered kosher if it has both fins and scales that are easily removable without tearing the skin. But these guys get into their usual late night what ifs – fish that are born with scales but lose them, fish that are born without and develop them, fish without spinal cords, fish that live part of their life in salt and part in freshwater, fish that resemble kosher or non-kosher land animals (sea donkeys, sea oxen). Oh, and by the way, don’t buy your blue dye from non-reputable housewives.
7/28/25, Page 40 – Today’s focus is eggs. It is proposed that kosher fish lay eggs, roe, in the water which then hatch later on their own; while non-kosher fish gestate the eggs internally and then give live birth. It is also proposed that bird eggs which are wide and round on one end and coming to a point on the other are from kosher birds and therefore kosher, while eggs which are narrow and round on one end and come to a point on the other are from non-kosher birds.
7/29/25, Chapter 3, Page 41 – How do you know if a statue is really an idol and related to worship? The figure is holding either a staff, orb, or… bird… in its hand. Or, it can be holding a sword, but in that case, to distinguish it from a statue of a bandit, it must also be wearing a crown and have a ring on its finger. Them’s the rules.
7/30/25, Page 42 – Mercury. The god, not the planet. The idolatrous folk worshipped him by creating piles of stones at crossroads, him being the god of travelers. Further, if they were setting out on a journey, they might throw stones at his statue. Don’t ask me why, I don’t know. Hell, I asked several AIs and they couldn’t come up with a plausible answer. The real problem, for the Talmudic rabbis, was that those stones might then be used to pave a road, and if an observant Jew is not allowed to “derive benefit” from objects use in idolatrous worship… let’s just say there was a lot of walking along the sides of the roads.
7/31/25, Page 43 – Certain design elements are considered to be prohibited because they symbolize idolatrous worship. Most obvious to the rabbis given the other extant religions at the time were the sun, the moon, and noted human figures like a nursing woman (symbol of Eve) or Sar Apis (an Egyptian deity that some Jews had adopted as a symbol of Joseph). The big argument comes down to dragons. Are dragons a symbol of a deity or simply a symbol of wealth, power, etc.? No final determination is made as their are strong supporters on both sides. Jewish dragons? Who knew?
8/1/25, Page 44 – We are in on an argument over King David’s crown. First, supposedly, it was the crown taken from a defeated king, therefore, a piece of idolatrous worship, so why was it being put on David’s head. Second, it was stated that it weighed “one talent” of gold, which is approximately 75lbs, a fairly hefty weight to sit on one’s head. The arguments range over the crown’s real provenance, whether it was simply worth the equivalent of a talent of gold by virtue of embedded gemstones but weighed far less, whether it was propped up over his head, or simply set next to him. Maybe he just had a really strong neck. Weighty matters, indeed.
8/2/25, Page 45 – There are, you must know, people who worship mountains and hills. Or there certainly were back in biblical times. And, according to Rabbi Akiva, one of the most famed scholars, “Everywhere that you find a high mountain, or an elevated hill, or a leafy tree, know that there is idol worship there.”. Does that mean Jews must avoid all mountains, hills, or leafy trees? No, decide the sages – they can make use of all those, and benefit from them… unless the idol worshippers, the gentiles, have “covered them in silver or gold” – presumably an allusion to too many idols dotted about the slopes or hanging from branches.
8/3/25, Page 46 – Does an object which is intended for idol worship become forbidden when it is made or erected, or does it not become forbidden until someone actually worships it? Quite the thorny philosophical point, and there is no solid decision among the rabbinic counsel.
8/4/25, Page 47 – In the “Did you fall asleep in Biology 101 class?” annals… the rabbis rule that any offspring that a domestic animal gives birth to after it has been subjected to bestiality (do I have to draw you a picture?) is considered forbidden. It can’t be eaten, used for milking, or used for consecrated sacrifices. Why? Because there’s a chance, you see, just a chance, that the offspring might have been fathered by the man who engaged with his cow, goat, sheep….
8/5/25, Page 48 – Trees are in the spotlight today. Deriving benefit from a tree includes things like sitting in its shade or enjoying its fruits or nuts. Trees are, however, subject to idolatrous worship issues. If the tree was planted specifically for worship purposes (Christmas trees, we’re looking at you), it is forbidden. If a tree has an idol mounted on it or placed beneath it, it is forbidden until the idol is removed. The big one is a tree that has had branches removed from it in order to become an object of worship. The rabbis rule, to me it seems in reverse, and I don’t quite get it, that any branches that regrow from the hacked site are forbidden, but the tree itself is not. Maybe I’m misreading it and they’re talking about the branches that were taken being used for worship, not the tree itself. Christmas wreaths maybe?
8/6/25, Page 49 – An ashera was a sort of totem pole idol in Canaanite worship rituals. The wood from it, or even that shaved off it before its use, was considered prohibited for beneficial use. There is a long discussion on today’s page over using such shavings to heat a wood burning oven, since the wood is being destroyed, not worshipped. The rabbis conclude that if the shavings are used in an old, well-used oven, you can leave the oven to cool down and then start over with permitted wood and all is fine. If, however, the oven is brand new and the ashera shavings are used to heat it, the oven is irrevocably tainted and must be destroyed.
8/7/25, Chapter 4, Page 50 – We return, again, to the pilles of stones used to worship Mercury. After a bit of discussion over how many stones constitute an official worship pile (three or more, it is decided), the sages turn to stones that were originally used by Mercury worshippers for idolatrous purposes, but were later used by non-Mercury worshippers to pave roads. Acknowledging that some particularly orthodox Jews might still have qualms, the rabbis rule that since it was the gentiles themselves who negated the idolatrous nature of the stones, they are now permitted, and traveling those roads is just fine.
8/8/25, Page 51 – Though piles of stones and/or throwing stones at statues of Mercury seemed a trifle odd, it’s not like that’s totally off the wall for a ritual. But today, and I’m not even interested in the conversation of permitted versus prohibited for Jews to later interact, we have idol worship that involves chamber pots of urine, “moist excrement”, snapping sticks, and crushing locusts. Like… what sort of warped mind did it take to come up with these sort of rituals as acts of worship? I’m not saying that blood sacrifices of animals or humans were any saner, they all involve a mindset that I can’t even imagine.
8/9/25, Page 52 – While much of today’s page covers situations and requirements for how to redeem an idolatrous object and make it permitted, I think that glosses over a little gem interwoven in the text. If a gentile creates an object to be used for idolatrous worship, the general take is that it doesn’t become forbidden until it is first used for that purpose. However, if a Jew creates an object for idolatrous worship it is forbidden from the moment it is created. We’re back to “intention matters”, particularly in regard to not straying from God’s path.
8/10/25, Page 53 – A gentile cannot reverse the status of an idol unless it is his own, personal idol. A Jew can reverse the status of any idol. The preferred way, all around, is breaking off a part of it, disfiguring it, or smashing it, but there’s a long litany of special cases and special ways to remove the prohibited status of a an object.
8/11/25, Page 54 – I hadn’t thought this far ahead in the world of things being worshipped as gods being forbidden for Jews to derive benefit from. What do we do about religions that worship the earth, the sun, the moon, the stars, the wind… etc.? Clearly sensing that this could turn into a truly bizarre debate, the rabbinic council swiftly rules that such things are in God’s hands to deal with in his/her own time and place and when it comes to objects of worship that are basically out of our hands, we should just get on with daily life.
8/12/25, Page 55 – If God wants to stop idol worship, why not just destroy all the idols? If God doesn’t want people to believe that worshipping idols cures them of ailments and injuries, why does he let them be cured, or even cure them, when they do so? If God knows that idols are powerless, and that other gods either don’t exist or are less then he is, why is he jealous of idol worship? The rabbis respond with a series of parables, but all of them relate to human weaknesses. One might ask, why is God being given a pass for having human faults?
8/13/25, Page 56 – In the process of making kosher wine, at what point does allowing a gentile, or a Jew who is currently impure, to physically touch the wine, render it prohibited from either wine for drinking or wine for consecration? The general consensus is that for consecration it is at the point where the fermenting wine forms a cap on top of the seeds and skins, i.e., after pressing the grapes and putting the juice (with or without solids) into the fermentation tank; while for simple drinking, it is not until the yeast has been added to start the fermentation process.
8/14/25, Page 57 – Our focus today is on whether an infant or juvenile gentile causes a wine to become non-kosher if they have contact with it. In a nutshell, the kosher law is that the wine can never be touched by a gentile during its elaboration (after the crushing process, as noted yesterday). The argument ranges over who the gentile child is – a random child, or the child of either a servant or slave to the household, and what their religious status is. Like many of the kosher rulings, it’s complicated, and often, intention matters.
8/15/25, Page 58 – The bigwigs of the rabbinic fold are having a retreat to discuss (and no doubt imbibe) the ins and outs of wine. On the table, the question of whether wine is prohibited if a gentile happened to touch it, intentionally or not, through any of various actions (sampling, stirring, mixing, moving, etc.). In particular, if he has no idolatrous intentions. In a classic “fence around the Torah” proscription, the rabbis decide that while the wine wouldn’t be prohibited as a matter of literal interpretation of the law, the presence of the gentile in proximity to the wine might lead to questions, and decide to prohibit any wine that a gentile “might” have had contact with.
8/16/25, Page 59 – Although there’s a bit of hedging, especially in the case of a gentile who is in the process of converting to Judaism, all this stuff basically came down to “don’t eat any food cooked by gentiles nor drink any wine fermented or served by them”. It was a very isolationist policy, perhaps necessary in the time and place, but one that has not really endured to modern day, other than perhaps among the most ultra-Orthodox.
8/17/25, Page 60 – We continue with all the various situations in which a gentile might touch, shake, pour, or otherwise act upon wine and why, 99 times out of a 100 that renders the wine prohibited for sacramental use, though often not for drinking. My favorite, however, has to be that if a gentile falls into a vat of wine and is rescued, the wine is prohibited, because he will be joyful and celebrate and possibly offer praise to his god. On the other hand, if he dies and his corpse is recovered, the wine is permitted, because, after all, he can’t offer praise to his idolatrous god.
8/18/25, Page 61 – If a gentile wants to be able to sell his wine to Jews, he has to hire a Jewish winemaker. And, at all steps of the production process, a Jew must be present to safeguard the wine from being touched by a gentile. But here’s where it gets weird. Assuming that you’re in a city that is primarily a gentile city, as many were and are, it can be assumed that gentile properties are basically contiguous throughout the city. Therefore, the Jewish guard doesn’t have to stay aside the wine vats and storage areas, but can get up and wander around the city, as long as he stays in publicly connected areas, as it’s just as if he was right there in the room. Talk about loopholes….
8/19/25, Chapter 5, Page 62 – In another one of those workarounds, we have, once again, a gentile who is producing wine, or growing produce and selling it during the Sabbatical year. If a Jew goes to work for him specifically to produce wine that will be used for idolatrous purposes, or grow and sell the crops, he is prohibited from accepting pay for his labor. However, if he is hired as a general laborer, and just happens to participate in the production of that wine or growing and sale of those crops, he is permitted to accept his wages.
8/20/25, Page 63 – Follow this train of thought… today’s discussion starts with the intricacies of payments to a prostitute and “oops I screwed up” sacrificial atonements afterwards. That led to me wondering what the Orthodox rules about prostitution actually are, since frequenting prostitutes pops up in the Talmud… frequently. Which led to Kiddushin 40 and “If a man sees that his inclinations overwhelm him, he should go to a place where he is unknown, wear black clothing and cover himself with black, and do what his heart desires, so that he does not publicly profane God’s name.” Which led to memories from the 80s of a gay adult “club” in lower Manhattan where one could virtually always spot one or more Chasidim in full black, furtively cruising.
8/21/25, Page 64 – I’ve commented more than once over the years of this project on the minutiae that the Talmudic rabbis ofttimes get wrapped up in. We know there’s a prohibition on growing different crops together in the same field. It’s never been clear why, but so be it, God said so, we gotta do it. Today we are confronted with a plot of land that has two different crops growing in it, but also, has a third plant, an unplanned for weed crop, but it’s a weed that will successfully eliminate one of the other two crops. The dilemma is… weeding out this third plant growing there eliminates its effectiveness in getting rid of the second plant, and therefore, it is argued, isn’t permitted, but it’s also required, because it’s a third crop. Needless to say, the argument goes in circles. Bizarrely, to me, no one suggests just pulling out both the second and third crops at the same time.
8/22/25, Page 65 – Into the kitchen today! If anyone, Jew or gentile, adds a non-kosher ingredient to a dish that is cooking, one might assume it renders the dish not kosher. However, it turns out, that’s only true if, in the opinion of the one cooking it, or the one it’s being cooked for, feels that the ingredient improved the flavor of the dish. If, however, in your opinion it either worsened the flavor, or had a neutral effect on the flavor, then the dish remains kosher. I assume this is behind some of the permitted use of certain preservatives or other additives that, say, improve shelf-life, color, etc., but don’t affect the flavors of processed foods.
8/23/25, Page 66 – “Forbidden spices that are known by two or three different names but are of the same species, or of three different species, are forbidden, and combine together to render a dish forbidden.” I have to admit, this one caught me by surprise. I always sort of think of any plant materials as being automatically kosher, but that’s not actually the case, and particularly not for plants grown in Israel (there’s a whole holy land set of rules). Considerations about cross contamination, contact with non-kosher materials during packaging, drying, smoking, or other processing, all come into play.
8/24/25, Page 67 – They’re back on adding ingredients that do or do not enhance the flavor of a dish. Vinegar and salt are in the spotlight today and we are informed, by a group of rabbis who clearly have no clue how to cook, that adding vinegar or salt to a hot bean dish doesn’t enhance its flavor and therefore it’s fine to eat the dish. But, adding vinegar or salt to a cold bean dish does enhance the flavor and therefore is prohibited. If you ever needed any evidence that these guys are making things up as they go along….
8/25/25, Page 68 – Okay, you know this had to be coming. We’ve covered the permitted versus prohibited status of when a non-permitted ingredient added to a dish either improves its taste or has no real effect. But… what about if it makes it taste worse? Of course they were going to go there. And of course, there’s a disagreement on this one. Some of the sages say that since it wasn’t an improvement, you can still eat the dish, others say no, it’s still be adulterated with a substance that wouldn’t be permitted. No resolution on this one.
8/26/25, Page 69 – I did not see this one coming. If a mouse falls into a vat of liquid, beer, and vinegar are used as examples, it apparently improves the flavor, and therefore the liquid is prohibited. However, if the volume of the liquid is at least 101 times greater than the volume of the mouse, then the liquid is not prohibited because mice don’t improve the flavor all that much. Still, some of the rabbis objected because of concerns of ingesting mouse, period.
8/27/25, Page 70 – If a, or several, Jews are visiting the home of a gentile prostitute, a polite way of saying brothel, they can be forgiven for drinking non-kosher wine, as their lust for a gentile woman clearly overrides their normally sound judgment. On the other hand, if they are at a Jewish brothel, the same does not hold true, as their lust is just a normal sort, not overwhelming because of the nature of forbidden sexual encounters.
8/28/25, Page 71 – If you are buying property from a gentile and discover there is an item of idolatrous worship on the property, you can have the gentile remove it before you complete the purchase, and all is well. However, if you’ve already given him the money for the property, the idol is now yours, and your only remedy is to take it to The Dead Sea and cast it into the waters, with appropriate ritual and prayer. Due diligence of all furniture and fixtures is advised!
8/29/25, Page 72 – With all the rules about wine being touched by gentiles being forbidden, some as strict as the gentile simply having touched the wine barrel, I have to admit, I would have never expected this one. Today we are introduced to the kenishkanin, a large drinking vessel filled with wine, which is shared communally by Jew and gentile alike, through separate straws. Yes, this is permitted, as a way to socialize and celebrate with gentiles (as long as it’s not an idolatrous ceremony), and it is recommended for the Jews participating to cease drinking before the gentiles do, because of the possibility of backwash. But come on, really, drinking wine with a straw?
8/30/25, Page 73 – If a forbidden substance is added to wine or water or dough or a stew, but little by little, each time less than the minimum amount required to be declared forbidden, then the main body does not become forbidden. It is, according to the rabbis, neutralized and nullified, each time. Clearly these guys have never seen a TV show or movie where someone is poisoned by dosing their morning beverage a little at a time. Know your crime plot tropes!
8/31/25, Page 74 – Despite the previous page’s micro-dosing permissions, there are certain contaminants that no matter how small the amount added, they render things prohibited for sacred use: regular drinking wine, objects of idol worship, hides from animals whose heart was removed for a sacrifice, meat from an animal that was slaughtered in retaliation for it killing a person, birds used in leper curing ceremonies, a Nazirite’s hair, a firstborn donkey, meat cooked in milk, and the meat of non-kosher animal that was sacrificed on Temple grounds.
9/1/25, Page 75 – How to purify things that gentiles have used. That’s the question on the table today. Things like wine and olive presses and their accompaniments get cleaned in ashes and water. There is some debate over whether it should be clear, naturally flowing water, or boiling water, preferably infused with olives. And then there are pots and pans, some say they should be immersed in water, some say they should be heated to “white-hot”, and others suggest a good polishing will do the trick. Cooties. That’s what this is all about. Gentile cooties.
9/2/25, Page 76 – The tractate ends with a return to one of those legalistic arguments that has popped up repeatedly in the Talmud. The “fence around Torah”. It’s the rabbinical act of being overly protective of any semblance of violating a Torah precept. In this case, they look back at all these prohibitions against using items that were obtained from gentiles and noting that the Torah only prohibits their use “on the same day” that the gentile used them. All the rest is avoidance of the appearance of impropriety.

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